Why Islam should be stronger than European

uBeR · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 966 **Location:**

I believe the Islam race should be stronger than of the European. "But wouldn't that just make the game even more imbalanced?" No, because they should also create Islam to be more susceptible to Chinese attacks. That is to say, Islam should be strong against Europeans but weak against Chinese. Since Europeans are already strong against Chinese, this would greatly balance the game. (Europeans are not incredibly stronger than Chinese, so Islam needn't be incredibly strong against European or incredibly weak against Chinese).

Imagine the possibilities of this setup. It basically creates a system of triangulation (jobbing) within another system of triangulation (Islam vs. European vs. Chinese) that can perfectly balance itself. (That is, jobbing will be fun again if this is implemented.) Joymax has the potential to create a very good game in this fashion in such a manner that it fosters more commitment towards team work and balance. There will be great cohesiveness and different utilization of skills and specialization under this system. The potential is high.

Do you agree?

Starrie · **Joined:** Feb 2008 **Posts:** 1170 **Location:**

Well, from what I understand out of your post, you mean that:
Islam > Euro > Chinese > Islam?

If thats true, it will be greatly balanced and fun to job as you said.
I agree with that.

uBeR · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 966 **Location:**

Yes, that's basically it.

IronHorse · **Joined:** May 2008 **Posts:** 57 **Location:**

but what could they do to make islam able to kill euros better then chinese can?

Phix · **Joined:** Mar 2008 **Posts:** 716 **Location:** Ephesus

IronHorse wrote:

but what could they do to make islam able to kill euros better then chinese can?

time will tell.. maybe more dps, so that they can outdamage the euro pots.. but the chinese wont have probz with them due to the tiny pot delay the chinese have,

personally i think it will work siwht summoning monsters or somethingi n that direction.

like having 10 Wolves (but then ingame monsters)

and they ill act just like normal wolves. so they can attac kthe euro's and you run away like a pussie

and chinese can handel the DPS from 10 wolves easily so they can chase the islam person and 1/2/3 hit them.

thats my guess probably wrong but who cares i like the idea

Rhe7oric · **Joined:** Mar 2008 **Posts:** 711 **Location:**

By equal, how do you mean? Equal in damage output? Equal in survivability? Equal in PvP? Explain please.

The way I see it, Euros are meant for high damage but relatively low survivability when soloing, and shine when in parties. Chinese are the solo class, able to do decent damage and solo exceptionally well. So it makes sense that the Islamic class should be a mix of both; maybe with a 5 second pot delay but slightly more damage than a Chinese but less than a Euro?

foudre · **Joined:** Jul 2007 **Posts:** 3604 **Location:**

Rhe7oric wrote:

By equal, how do you mean? Equal in damage output? Equal in survivability? Equal in PvP? Explain please.

The way I see it, Euros are meant for high damage but relatively low survivability when soloing, and shine when in parties. Chinese are the solo class, able to do decent damage and solo exceptionally well. So it makes sense that the Islamic class should be a mix of both; maybe with a 5 second pot delay but slightly more damage than a Chinese but less than a Euro?

ya that sound about right, plus muslims will have summons as its assumed, they would have their summons plus their pets, that could make them easily have the same as multiple wolves effect wise depending on how the summons work. I bet muslims will have both self buffs and party buffs but party buffs as weak as a chinese buff, and if they have summons probally buffs that will relate to the summons

edit:

i bet they will be able to function in a party but not as well as a euro and surivie really well solo

NobleHunter · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 8:06 am

Rhe7oric wrote:

By equal, how do you mean? Equal in damage output? Equal in survivability? Equal in PvP? Explain please.

The way I see it, Euros are meant for high damage but relatively low survivability when soloing, and shine when in parties. Chinese are the solo class, able to do decent damage and solo exceptionally well. So it makes sense that the Islamic class should be a mix of both; maybe with a 5 second pot delay but slightly more damage than a Chinese but less than a Euro?

i couldn´t say it better. i think the same, is not about lower damage or higher damage... its about playing style.

/Pi · **Joined:** May 2007 **Posts:** 4592 **Location:**

Where's Barotix when you want him to talk about the Islam race?

Extrme_G · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 748 **Location:**

Barotix we need your comment

Mango · **Joined:** Jul 2007 **Posts:** 171 **Location:**

Personally I think that the summons will have a skill similar to Scorn, so that although Europeans can do lots of damage it won't actually affect the Islamic character until the summon has died, giving them enough time to kill the euro, and obviously this won't work well against the Chinese because they can just tank the Islam guy until the summon is dead and then kill him too.

Barotix · **Joined:** Jul 2007 **Posts:** 9250 **Location:** Sand

Quote:

Party:
European > Mixed = Islam > Chinese
Solo:
Chinese > Islam > European
E.G.:
Overall, European = Chinese = Islam. A.K.A. Balance

Elaborate:
If Chinese is the best at solo play overall and the worst at party play overall, then they're in the Middle ground Overall.
If European are the worst at solo overall and The best at party over all, then they're in the Middle ground Overall.
Therefore, Chinese = European. (here is where Islam complicates matters)

Islam is speculated, based on information laid ALL OVER the net, to be able to solo decently without much hindrance and be able to party well without ruining the potential efficiency of the party.

Now here is a illustration to explain matters: Imagine a rating, 1 being the lowest possible 3 being the highest. Then take the averages to get the overall balance, afterwards substitute the number in overall for the civilization corresponding with that overall category.
1--------2--------3
European:
[1]Solo
[3]Party
[2]Overall

Chinese:
[3]Solo
[1]Party
[2]Overall

Islam:
[2]Solo
[2]Party
[2]Overall

Overall:
so: [2]=[2]=[2]
Substitution: European = Islam = Chinese

Party: [3]>[2]>[1]
Substitution: European > Mixed=Islam > Chinese

Solo: [1]<[2]<[3]
Substitution: European < Islam < Chinese

So conclusion, Joymax planned the game well:
If you prefer party play, go European.
If you prefer solo play, go Chinese.
If you Like doing both every now and then, go Islamic.

The game is already balanced/will be balanced and it isn't Euro VS Chinese VS Islam. At 90 cap the Chinese take their crown back as lords of 1v1.

DarkJackal · **Joined:** Feb 2006 **Posts:** 6119 **Location:** A den~

I think they should just tone down Euro a bit, then make Islam equally balanced for both Euro and Chinese, THEN, if anyone wanted to a make a char from either race, they could go make a char, lvl up, get decent gear, and then go pvp and normal kill or be killed anyone/by anyone who has better gear/skills, like a normal game should be >.>.

ranger4life · **Joined:** Mar 2006 **Posts:** 2526 **Location:**

why we talking bout islam? its not gonna come out for a loong time

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 12:33 pm

It would be nice, but well...Why speculate about it when it is far far far ahead of us. If kSRO doesn't have plans for it, neither will we. (kSRO's Islam + 1-1.5 year = iSRO's Islam probably).

HappyMonkey · **Joined:** May 2008 **Posts:** 66 **Location:**

i like it.. im sure thats what joymax will eventually do because so many are complaining about overpowerment now

NuclearSilo · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 1:43 pm

Dmg output:
Euro > chinese > islam

Defense & HP regeneration rate:
Islam > chinese > euro

AngelEyes · **Joined:** Jan 2008 **Posts:** 633 **Location:**

HappyMonkey wrote:

i like it.. im sure thats what joymax will eventually do because so many are complaining about overpowerment now

Ppl are complaining about bots too, I don't see to much change there. (recent goldbot ban not withstanding)

NoOneSpecial · **Joined:** Feb 2008 **Posts:** 15 **Location:** hell

HappyMonkey wrote:

i like it.. im sure thats what joymax will eventually do because so many are complaining about overpowerment now

Joymax laughs at these comments.. You are playing in their world, not some open sourced project where you have a say. The only say you have is whether you play or not. These people made millions of dollars without any input from you or our community and will continue to do so.

I hear Joymax is cracking down on Intellectual property issues next. ie Proprietary artwork, Domain names that may be confused with their actual intellectual property. etc..

ThisIsAvalon · **Joined:** Nov 2007 **Posts:** 1163 **Location:**

Barotix wrote:

At 90 cap the Chinese take their crown back as lords of 1v1.

I really doubt that. Once we start seeing full sosun + 7 geared up warrior/clerics, we'll see.

penfold1992 · **Joined:** Apr 2007 **Posts:** 4060 **Location:**

this would work

euro bad hp good attack
china ok hp ok attack
islam good hp bad attack

then... islam will beat euros (eventually pot delay will make them suffer)
china beat islam (islam hardly damages a chinese so they sit and tank)
euro beat chine (good attacks ect..)

we know that it isnt always the case but that would work i think

NuclearSilo · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 2:47 pm

How come a chinese can beat Islam if they have high HP? Even a blader hardly kill another str chinese...

ThisIsAvalon · **Joined:** Nov 2007 **Posts:** 1163 **Location:**

Unless islam has absolute damage skills, they wont come anywhere near a euro. Euros can have lvl 10 and lvl 9 bless spells running 24/7, as long as everyone in the party has cleric sub. Thats what, 4000 mag def?

People gotta stop dreaming, Euro > All, and it'll always be that way unless Joymax changes bless.

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 3:41 pm

ThisIsAvalon wrote:

Unless islam has absolute damage skills, they wont come anywhere near a euro. Euros can have lvl 10 and lvl 9 bless spells running 24/7, as long as everyone in the party has cleric sub. Thats what, 4000 mag def?

People gotta stop dreaming, Euro > All, and it'll always be that way unless Joymax changes bless.

We're ofcourse talking about 1 vs 1...

ThisIsAvalon wrote:

Barotix wrote:

At 90 cap the Chinese take their crown back as lords of 1v1.

I really doubt that. Once we start seeing full sosun + 7 geared up warrior/clerics, we'll see.

Unless they **** up the droprate, it will take the whole 90 cap before we could perhaps see full sun people (Euro or Chinese)

ThisIsAvalon · **Joined:** Nov 2007 **Posts:** 1163 **Location:**

[SW]XMoshe wrote:

Unless they **** up the droprate, it will take the whole 90 cap before we could perhaps see full sun people (Euro or Chinese)

Thats not the point, though. So far, chinese have been the people with full sunned gears ONLY, and STILL get 1shot by euros. Now that euros and chinese are on even playing grounds for suns, theres no telling what will happen now. 1 shot chinese without life control and still be able to tank?

Quote:

We're ofcourse talking about 1 vs 1...

Okay, in a 1vs1 situation with a war/cleric:

45 seconds - iron + mana skin
45 second - bless spell
30 seconds - Pull out shield and tank
45 seconds - iron + mana skin
75 seconds - Use 9,259 Vital Increase, switch to sword/shield and do shield bash

Repeat. You will only be semi-vulnerable for 40% of the time pvping, which in that time you'll have shield up, and 37,628 hp instead of 28,389. I'm sure with a full sun set, you'll be able to survive for 60 seconds...

Besides, with a 76+9 sosun 2h, I doubt you wont be able to kill someone 1vs1 with 165 seconds to kill him.

Anyways, max recovery division > lvl 90 pots.

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 4:07 pm

ThisIsAvalon wrote:

[SW]XMoshe wrote:

Unless they **** up the droprate, it will take the whole 90 cap before we could perhaps see full sun people (Euro or Chinese)

Thats not the point, though. So far, chinese have been the people with full sunned gears ONLY, and STILL get 1shot by euros. Now that euros and chinese are on even playing grounds for suns, theres no telling what will happen now. 1 shot chinese without life control and still be able to tank? Full sun ints may be 1shotted by euro's..And pure str full sun perhaps from a rogue with crit, but otherwise they are no where near a 1hit. And that's not now the point, and never will be..unless they make the droprate after the 80 cap ofcourse, but let's pretend they won't.

Quote:

We're ofcourse talking about 1 vs 1...

Okay, in a 1vs1 situation with a war/cleric:

60 seconds - iron + mana skin
45 second - bless spell
60 seconds - iron + mana skin
60 seconds - Use 9,259 Vital Increase, switch to sword/shield and do shield bash

Repeat. You will only be semi-vulnerable for 25% of the time pvping, which in that time you'll have shield up, and a shitload of hp. I'm sure with a full sun set, you'll be able to survive for 60 seconds...

A decent Chinese can tank that too..So that would be a fight to the end.

Glavie's Girl · **Joined:** Jun 2007 **Posts:** 1464 **Location:**

yea XMoshe I hope joymax has found out the right difinition of the word "rare" sun drop. =/ I dont really want a repeat of the last cap. ><

ThisIsAvalon · **Joined:** Nov 2007 **Posts:** 1163 **Location:**

[SW]XMoshe wrote:

A decent Chinese can tank that too..So that would be a fight to the end.

Lets say its a blader. He will be in garment most likely, since 90% of STR chars are. At the 80 cap, with a +9 normal 2h, all you need is 2 lucky crits and hes dead. Now, add a sosun. That would be like a +15 weapon, not including reinforce. No decent Chinese could tank that. ONLY Chinese that could POSSIBLY tank that would be a pure str bow, and thats all he could do. Tank. 6 arrow + 5 arrow over and over. Once the 2h gets a knockdown or stun on him, game over.

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri May 16, 2008 4:26 pm

ThisIsAvalon wrote:

[SW]XMoshe wrote:

A decent Chinese can tank that too..So that would be a fight to the end.

Lets say its a blader. He will be in garment most likely, since 90% of STR chars are. At the 80 cap, with a +9 normal 2h, all you need is 2 lucky crits and hes dead. Now, add a sosun. That would be like a +15 weapon, not including reinforce. No decent Chinese could tank that. ONLY Chinese that could POSSIBLY tank that would be a pure str bow, and thats all he could do. Tank. 6 arrow + 5 arrow over and over. Once the 2h gets a knockdown or stun on him, game over.

Yeah a normal +9 lol..There's only been one +9 2hander on Xian, and that one failed +10 xD

piXie_niXie · **Joined:** Feb 2008 **Posts:** 666 **Location:**

this is NOTHING like the jobbing triangulation

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